Noah and Abraham

I read the story as saying that Noah saved the human species from extinction and Abraham saved no one. He asked if there are 50, 40, etc., but stopped at 10, accomplishing nothing. If he had continued to 4, getting the same response at each number, he could have saved the city. Reply

I think it is unfair to compare because each was an individual of his own time, Thus, Noah was NOT ready to do more than obey H'. Abraham is stronger for a variety of reasons spelled in the Torah already, thus he dares to challenge H'. It is not the world because H' promised to Noah that this would not happen again. Yet, human nature didn't change, and there were enough people in Sodom and Gemorah to make H' react. Both -Noah and Abraham- teach us lessons: a time to obey, and a time to challenge. I takes courage to do both. I don't truly like diminishing Noah, he did his best, and so did Abraham Avinu. Reply

Correct, and Noach did things Adam did not. Human kind grew. Reply

I think that Noah was persecuted by his contemporaries, which is why he did not argue against their destruction. We can say that the entire world was destroyed for his sake. Apparently, he left the doors of the ark open for others to join him. Reply

Now it is time for the Jewish people to carry out their responsibility to be that light to the world.

We are being pressured to do what is expected from us. Blows will come more frequently to remind us to perform.

Our spiritual source is the guideline.
The spiritual depth of the Torah or the authentic Kabbalistic sources provide the wisdom, the light. This information must be disseminated to humanity.

It is time for humanity to know who they are, what is the meaning of life and how to reach our destiny.

Humanity needs to shift from individualism, egoism and competition to wholeness, altruism and cooperation.
The entire world must become as one mind in one heart. Reply

I have read this comment before. It falls short to Noah. Abraham built on an older experience. An experience obviously been discussed. We all learned from Eva when she mistakenly believed the handsome snake as last week was pointed out. Even before that we learned as later, not to add anything to the torah, like perhaps Adam did, when he may have said: do not eat from that tree, not even touch it. So, many people made wiser decisions later on the earthly path of the existence of earth, and under the guidance of the Eternal One.
Other people wrote books as an addition to the Torah, because they felt that the Jewish people tell short.
I am not judging your opinion, but something told me to ask you why it is that you got this opinion about the the intent of Noah?

But concerning Abraham, Scripture says (below 24:40): “[the Lord] before Whom I walked.” Noah required [God’s] support to uphold him [in righteousness], but Abraham strengthened himself and walked in his righteousness by himse Reply

I like what you say about the different positions of Noe and Abraham, for me it was necessary, but I couldn't quite grasp the following: "If there was something wrong, it needed to be changed. Even if it had been decreed by the will of G ‑ d. " How can anyone change what is decreed by the Eternal Abba? Reply

Both did as they were asked. It is not for us to judge who did better. Reply

Didn't Hashem ask Abraham to find at least one "good" person ?(In reference to Sodom)


Did Hashem ask the same of Noah?

Why is Moses not mentioned he asked Hashem for forgivenss for the people ? Reply

Is G-d really telling us that Noach could have changed His mind about destroying the world and starting over? Is G-d really telling us Noach was selfish? "Put on a warm coat for himself" actually in reality, means saving the world as we know it, for US to have and enjoy today. Reply

Noach did what G-d told him to do so that there would be a world for future generations.
My question is was the ark tall enough to comfortably fit the giraffes or did they need to bend their necks for a year? Pictures show them outside the ark but I'm sure no animals were outside the ark. Reply

Noah got drunk after planting a vineyard that followed his release from the ark. I wondered why Noah did this somewhat foolish act until I learned that he subsequently realized that he could (like Abraham) have asked G-d for mercy for the inhabitants of our world, but he didn't. This illustrates the difference in character between these two men. Reply

Why did Abraham stop at 10? Abraham says "if 50 are good", "if 40", etc., and G-d says he'll spare the city for the sake of the 50, 40, etc., but Abraham stops at 10, and there aren't 10 good ones, so the destruction goes ahead.

But there are at least 4 good ones; Lot, his wife, and his daughters. So if Abraham had kept going a little longer, and said "if 9 are found, will you spare the city for their sake", etc., and gotten G-d to agree to spare the city even if only 4 were found, then the city would have been spared.

Why didn't he? Why did he stop at 10? Reply

If Abraham was 58 years old when Noah died, does that mean that Noah saw Sodom and Gomorroh?

Would Noah have lived longer if he did not see Sodom and Gomorrah?

The negative world has increased greatly in just the past 150 years. Reply

Zusia was dying. And he wept. His disciples asked why he wept. He said, Gd will not ask me, Why weren't you Noah? Gd already had a Noah.

Bd will not ask me, Why weren't you Abraham? Gd already had an Abraham.

Gd will not ask me, Why weren't you Moses? Gd already had a Moses.

But Gd WILL ask me, Why weren't you Zusia? And to that question, I don't know what I can possibly answer Him.

Gd only asks us to be fully ourselves. And that is challenging. Reply

Who was the greatest salesman ever? It was Abraham. He came home after being out and about, and told his household that G-d had spoken to him. Therefore, all males will be circumcised, including his teenage son. No one else comes close. Reply

compare When it comes to Noah and Abraham there is no need to compare. Noah was a great man, and we can list reasons starting with the times in which he lived. Abraham was a great man and we can list reasons why this is so. Both men had a greatness about them.

Otherwise we can debate how Abraham was great but Moses was greater.

My son is a world class doctor saving lives. Are your children saving anyone ? The comparison is unnecessary. We both love our children and learn not to compare, nor to hide behind a needless lesson about trumped up comparisons. Reply

Abraham's Discovery: WE need to CHANGE The Tower of Babel is a SYNBOL for the egoism causing the separation and hatred of others that errupted in Babylon in Abraham's time. He delved into our nature and discovered that this egoism is created to provide energy for us to direct it to unite us at a higher level of existence. He devised the method of correction of the ego (the Wisdom of Kabbalah)and taught it to all those who aspired to attain spirituality.

Abraham authored 'The Book Of Creation' in which he explained the 32 paths the forces emanating from the Source to control and manifest in our world.

The plan of Creation prompted the ego to endure periods of ups and downs (rise and destruction of 1st and 2nd Temples) until our time when it has maxed out and now we are ready to perform the final correction using Abraham's method for all humanity. Reply

Give it up for Noah ! CA - Nov 6 2011 I think Abraham saved Lot and a couple others but i take your point as follows: Abraham should have bargained harder at Sodom. Even a great Patriarch can fall short.

Take Moses. Moses was the greatest salesman ever because he told Hashem that if he destroyed the nation of Israel on account of the Golden Calf, he wanted his own name erased from the Torah. Moses' bargain succeeded. Yet, as we know, Moses had his own shortcomings to deal with and for those he was not allowed into the Promised Land.

So here we have three giants of the Torah, all in their own right, and beyond any need for comparison. It's not a horse race.

Another pertinent example is Hillel and Shammai. When compared, which is always, Hillel comes off as the kinder one. Nothing could be further from the truth. They were both very kind and to top it off, they were best friends.

So, give it up for Noah, Abraham and Moses and anyone who loves their neighbor as themselves. G-d has a soft spot for all of those. Reply

How to save the world..yours, mine, theirs..= His How do you save the world? You start locally to act globally...create an enterprise. Follow the Torah. integrate the 2. Just like the strands of DNA act as a team, as husband and wife create a family, so too we must adapt to time's functions and the future is forged through a bi-partisan perspective of 2 worlds, physical and the spiritual.

Noah was introverted, Abraham extroverted... ou cannot sit idly when you know there is suffering going on and that is where the world will take us..to save every soul!
I question if I must be like King David and King Solomon to save the Jewish nation, but must I try to merge their life with that of Abraham and Noah's? Will another flood wipe out 2/3 the population of the world, then will there be 1,000 years of repair? Will we lift Israel off the ground through a technological ark? Or send people to the Moon, Mars, and another Diaspora happen?
We must lead the world: Grow2 Love your fellow man as yourself-Social/Economical/environmental growth Reply